MiG-3 flaps are still broken

[Valis]

Flaps Down: Long Press - Increase Limiter Angle

Flaps Down: Short Press - Lower Flaps (to limiter)

Flaps Up: Long Press - Decrease Limiter Angle

Flaps Up: Short Press - Raise Flaps

Pretty sure this is how it's supposed to function in-game, but currently it doesn't work and (if Google search is any guide) hasn't worked in five years.

 

Edited January 17 by Valis

[Czech693]

18 hours ago, Valis said:

Flaps Down: Long Press - Increase Limiter Angle

Flaps Down: Short Press - Lower Flaps (to limiter)

Flaps Up: Long Press - Decrease Limiter Angle

Flaps Up: Short Press - Raise Flaps

Pretty sure this is how it's supposed to function in-game, but currently it doesn't work and (if Google search is any guide) hasn't worked in five years.

 

No, that's how it used to work.  It was close to realistic except in RL you could only adjust the limiter with the flaps raised, and it was controlled by two controllers, a wheel for the limiter and a short lever for the flaps (both on the left side of the seat).  The devs changed the function to implement the issue of the flaps having to be raised to adjust the limiter, and in the process they completely changed how it functions.  Now, you push down to set the limiter and the flaps automatically deploy to that limit when you release the flap control.  You cannot set the limiter to a position ahead of time and deploy the flaps later like the real plane (and the way the original sim setup was working, but with only one flap control).

[Valis]

Got it, thanks!

Should've just given us a separate limiter control, maybe?

[Czech693]

Yes, that would have been the way to go.  But they left it unfinished and incorrect.  Many people asked them to return it to the original if they were not going to fix the fix, but they just left the way it is now. lt was closer to the real thing originally.

[FeuerFliegen]

Please devs, PLEASE just change it to the way it was originally!  It may have not been perfect, but it was SUBSTANTIALLY better than it is now.  I, as well as many other people, do not understand why you did not just leave it the way it was.

[RSN]

В реальности закрылки МиГ-3 должны работать так, как это было сделано конструкторами:

"В движение закрылки приводил пневматический привод, обеспечивающий два фиксированных положения: 18 градусов и 50 градусов."

Информация в ссылке ниже.

In reality, the flaps of the MiG-3 should work the way it was done by the designers: 

"The flaps were driven by a pneumatic actuator providing two fixed positions: 18 degrees and 50 degrees."

The information is in the link below.

https://airpages.ru/ru/mig3con.shtml

 

 

 

[AEthelraedUnraed]

7 hours ago, RSN said:

В реальности закрылки МиГ-3 должны работать так, как это было сделано конструкторами:

"В движение закрылки приводил пневматический привод, обеспечивающий два фиксированных положения: 18 градусов и 50 градусов."

Информация в ссылке ниже.

In reality, the flaps of the MiG-3 should work the way it was done by the designers: 

"The flaps were driven by a pneumatic actuator providing two fixed positions: 18 degrees and 50 degrees."

The information is in the link below.

https://airpages.ru/ru/mig3con.shtml

This 1941 document says otherwise: (page 24/25, translation courtesy of Google)

Quote

LANDING FLAPS CONTROL

The flaps are pneumatically controlled. The control cylinder, one for both flaps, is located under the cabin floor. To extend the flaps, air is supplied to the forward half of the cylinder, and to retract it to the rear half. The piston rod is connected by a system of rods and bellcranks to rods running along the flaps on the wing and center section and mounted in roller cages. These rods carry short pushrods, which transmit the longitudinal movement of the rods to the flaps, causing them to lower or raise. The maximum opening angle of the flaps is -50 degrees. However, it is possible to limit the deflection of the flaps using a "setter" controlled by the control wheel on the left side. of the cabin. The steering wheel is connected by two cables to the helm, which can be set to positions of 0, 10, 20°, 30°, 40° and 50°, indicated on the floor by an arrow connected to the slider. The slider moves along a toothed guide fixedly connected to the cabin floor truss. The rod, exiting the cylinder, retracts, the position of which determines the flaps' angle of release. The release mechanism is installed in the same way as the control valve; when releasing the flaps, only the control valve is used, which is identical to the landing gear valve and has three positions: "retracted," neutral, and "released."

The pneumatic flap control diagram is shown together with the landing gear control diagram. For the MiG-3, the reliable operation of the flaps is crucial, as landing without flaps causes a significant increase in landing speed and landing roll. Flaps should be extended at speeds no greater than 250 km/h.

Which is pretty much the system depicted in game, except for there only being 5 different settings. In any case, it's clear that deploying or retracting the flaps required just a single "control valve"/button press, and that's the issue with the way the game currently works.

[Czech693]

No, that's not the way it works now.  IRL you adjust the limiter position with the wheel, and the flaps are lower or raised with the lever above the wheel.  So, IRL you could pre-set the limiter and lower the flaps when needed.  Then you could raise the flaps without changing the limiter.  But, you had to raise the flaps to adjust the limiter once the flaps were deployed because you would be trying to turn the wheel against the air pressure of the pneumatic cylinder.

The original flap control in the Sim worked similar to that with only one controller (toggle or button), so you held the controller until the limiter reach the setting you wanted.  When you released the controller, the flaps did not deploy.  A quick press of the controller would deploy or retract the flaps.  But both functions were on one controller.

The way it is now, you adjust the limiter and as soon as you release your flap controller (toggle or button) the flaps deploy to that limit.  And now when you adjust the limiter up the flaps retract immediately.  If you release the flap controller, the flaps re-deploy to whatever setting is on the limiter at that point.

It's basically a pneumatic (air pressure) system like the Spitfire and Yak.  Those two aircraft have only Up or Down.  On the MiG the limiter stops the flaps from full down position at any given setting.

 

[AEthelraedUnraed]

5 hours ago, Czech693 said:

No, that's not the way it works now.  IRL you adjust the limiter position with the wheel, and the flaps are lower or raised with the lever above the wheel.  So, IRL you could pre-set the limiter and lower the flaps when needed.  Then you could raise the flaps without changing the limiter.  But, you had to raise the flaps to adjust the limiter once the flaps were deployed because you would be trying to turn the wheel against the air pressure of the pneumatic cylinder.

The original flap control in the Sim worked similar to that with only one controller (toggle or button), so you held the controller until the limiter reach the setting you wanted.  When you released the controller, the flaps did not deploy.  A quick press of the controller would deploy or retract the flaps.  But both functions were on one controller.

The way it is now, you adjust the limiter and as soon as you release your flap controller (toggle or button) the flaps deploy to that limit.  And now when you adjust the limiter up the flaps retract immediately.  If you release the flap controller, the flaps re-deploy to whatever setting is on the limiter at that point.

It's basically a pneumatic (air pressure) system like the Spitfire and Yak.  Those two aircraft have only Up or Down.  On the MiG the limiter stops the flaps from full down position at any given setting.

I know how the MiG flaps work and how they used to work 🙂 When I said it's the system depicted in game, I did not mean to say it works properly, just that it corresponds to the dials and handles we have in the cockpit model.

[Czech693]

Okay, I'm sorry that I implied that you were wrong.