Air to Ground Anti Tank Cannons

[86Cheese]

Im struggling to decide whether this is a skill issue on my part, a lack of understanding or what exactly.

 

So we have a hand full of weapons intended to be used for anti tank, the duck, molins, 37mm, etc. But I can't seem to do much with any of them. If i hit a T34 3-5 times with the duck, I can disable it, but that's about it. Is there a good explanation of what works against what anywhere? It almost feels like the game is lacking the targets these weapons are effective against in career?

 

Idk, maybe Im just bad? Im really just sort of scratching the surface here, but this seems to be one of the less rewarding roles to pick up in GB, am I wrong? The Molins gun on the mossie and the 57mm? On the ME 410 just seem to bounce off of anything I hit with them, are these canons strictly intended for 4 engine heavys?

[ITAF_Airone1989]

2 hours ago, 86Cheese said:

Im struggling to decide whether this is a skill issue on my part, a lack of understanding or what exactly.

Spoiler

So we have a hand full of weapons intended to be used for anti tank, the duck, molins, 37mm, etc. But I can't seem to do much with any of them. If i hit a T34 3-5 times with the duck, I can disable it, but that's about it. Is there a good explanation of what works against what anywhere? It almost feels like the game is lacking the targets these weapons are effective against in career?

 

Idk, maybe Im just bad? Im really just sort of scratching the surface here, but this seems to be one of the less rewarding roles to pick up in GB, am I wrong? The Molins gun on the mossie and the 57mm? On the ME 410 just seem to bounce off of anything I hit with them, are these canons strictly intended for 4 engine heavys?

 

Depend how the mission was created and from the cannon's ammunition.

1) when you build a mission you can place a "real" tank (the one that can move and fight) or a "fake" one that is just static. The real has a normal damage model, so you can destroy that by cannon if you hit in the right spot. The other one works like a "building" and the last time I checked (years ago) it was possible to destroy it just with bombs. 

If you are playing an "official" mission (i.e. a campaign made by devs) or it they are moving you can be sure are the "real" ones. If you are in a multiplayer server you should ask to the mission maker.

2) when you select your loadout you can see there are both Blue and Orange bullets. The blue ones are Armor piercing, so if you expect to hunt tanks are the ones you want to have, the orange ones are High Explosive and there is no way you destroy a tank with that. 

Not all the cannon has both option, because some wasn't intended for ground attack. 

 

Destroy a tank it's in any case a pretty hard job, I usually try with the Duck and it required 2/3 good attacks.

I usually:

- approach directly from behind 

- use the 35% flap to keep a step dive 

- aim for the spot between the turret and the engine

In this way I can disable a couple of them before to be end my ammunition.

Still, don't expect that they explode. As soon as you see some smoke coming out from the engine they are done, then it's just matter of time (several minutes) before you get the kill 

 

 

[Avimimus]

I'd add that these are often fairly small rounds (compared to tank rounds) and it is possible that a penetrating round will not be lethal - so one often needs to fire a burst.

As for the BK-5 on the Me-410: This is literally a modified tank gun. However, it can only be used against soft targets, as it only carries high explosive rounds. This was how it was used historically (compare with the anti-shipping Molins gun on the Mosquito - which has only armour penetrating rounds).

P.S. The 23mm cannons and the Mk-101/Mk-103 are also anti-tank guns - although mainly effective against the vulnerable parts of tanks or against lighter armoured vehicles. If you can get the engine to smoke it counts as a kill.

[86Cheese]

So the molins gun is just for anti shipping, okay. What about the 37mm cannons on the IL2 or the Yak9T? Has anyone been able to get those to work against armor? They seem to be pretty useless in my experience.

[BlitzPig_EL]

Aim for the tank's engine deck.  It is the way.

[Avimimus]

18 hours ago, 86Cheese said:

So the molins gun is just for anti shipping, okay. What about the 37mm cannons on the IL2 or the Yak9T? Has anyone been able to get those to work against armor? They seem to be pretty useless in my experience.

Aircraft:

Historically the Molins was used for anti-shipping purposes. You can try to use it for other purposes if you want.

Historically the Il-2's 23mm and 37mm cannons were both intended for use against armour.

The LaGG-3 s.29 also has options for similar cannons as does the Yak-9T. The Hurricane IID carries 40mm cannons. For the other side the options are the Bf-110 and Ju-87 (both with 37mm cannon options), and the Hs-129 with its options for high velocity 30mm cannons.

 

Technique:

- Make sure you are attacking from the side or the rear. Your angle needs to be perfect for best effects - if the target isn't exactly sideways or from the rear don't expect to be very effective.

- If using wing guns: Check your gun convergence. If your bullets are falling to either side of the target they won't be effective (note that aircraft are wider than tanks).

- Make sure you select AP rounds (blue rounds in the loadout screen).

- Fire a prolonged burst with multiple rounds from close range.

The videos might be helpful:

 

[Avimimus]

This video provides a summary of actual WWII firing tests - and should give some idea why the terminal effects of these weapons are enough to disable a tank, but often won't cause it to explode:

Interestingly, they recommend starting the attack at 800 metres. This is partly possible because the Mk-101/Mk-103 has a very high velocity. However, most players conserve ammunition and only fire at 400-500 metres (when penetration changes are higher). Interestingly, the video author also advocates firing at a high airspeed to increase penetration (opposite of the tutorials).

[Aapje]

On 1/2/2026 at 6:37 AM, 86Cheese said:

Idk, maybe Im just bad?

The historic channels noticed that the tank hunters reported way better results than the loss records show. So most likely they just reported any bullet hits in the same postal code as the tank as a kill, while we actually see that the tanks mostly didn't get lethal damage.

[MajorMagee]

In Normandy, a post battle analysis found that typical air-to-ground vehicle kills were soft vehicles and fuel trailers. Armoured vehicles were damaged, but not often killed without a direct hit by a bomb or a rocket.

Link to reference

[MaxPower]

I think you need to make sure you're using AP rounds and the right weapon mods.  For instance, mg151/20s and mg151/15s are available for the duck.  Ironically, the smaller caliber round has much higher velocity and is better at getting through armor.  There's actually an antimaterial rifle from South Africa that uses these 15 and 20mm rounds in different configurations. 

 

Anyway I'm not the best tank buster, but from what I know is, the trick is to come in shallow and attack the side of the tank.  Any slope to your attack path is going to add slope and effective armour thickness to the target.  Aim for either the driver's compartment behind the front wheels or the engine deck.  I think the driver is only on one side tho.  The other side houses the bow machine gunner/radio operator usually.  If you do everything right it'll still usually take a few passes with guns only, but sometimes they die right away.  Hope anything I said here helps 🙂

[Aapje]

The ideal angle depends on the slope of the armor on the tank itself. You want to hit it at a 90 degree angle, to minimize the amount of armor in the path of the round.

[Avimimus]

1 hour ago, MaxPower said:

I think you need to make sure you're using AP rounds and the right weapon mods.  For instance, mg151/20s and mg151/15s are available for the duck.  Ironically, the smaller caliber round has much higher velocity and is better at getting through armor.

Yes. One also often sees the 15mm (MG-151/15) paired with the long barrelled 30mm (Mk-101 or Mk-103) in German proposals because the ballistics were more similar!

[Calos_01]

Actually Molins is a very good anti-tank gun. Usually, one well-placed shot is enough to stop a tank, and quite often it explodes (like the Panzer IV tonight). I had no problem taking out a Tiger either; I usually try to shoot from the side.

[CzechTexan]

@kraut1 had a mod in the old forum that dealt with this problem:

link to old forum discussion:  https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/89351-il2-gb-tank-engine-life-values-patchv02/

Edited January 4 by CzechTexan

[Asgar]

I love tank busting with cannons, as others have said steep dive hitting the engine deck works well or you can try to do shallow side on attacks for KW-1s aiming in between the tracks. 
 

gotta admit, still hoping we may get AP belts for the 410, even if not historically used. Would be nice to go tank busting with that 50mm

[kraut1]

22 minutes ago, Asgar said:

I love tank busting with cannons, as others have said steep dive hitting the engine deck works well or you can try to do shallow side on attacks for KW-1s aiming in between the tracks. 
 

gotta admit, still hoping we may get AP belts for the 410, even if not historically used. Would be nice to go tank busting with that 50mm

I like tank busting with cannons / Panzerblitz too.
But sometimes, if there is not sufficient time available for repeated attacks, either due to enemy fighters or competent enemy AAA,
my favorite anti tank weapon is the SC1000 for the BF110G2, Me410 and the FW190-G8...

Edited yesterday at 11:20 AM by kraut1

[Avimimus]

3 hours ago, Asgar said:

gotta admit, still hoping we may get AP belts for the 410, even if not historically used. Would be nice to go tank busting with that 50mm

If evidence could be found that the B6 used AP rounds for its Mk-103... then there is maybe a chance for that. I've doubts about the BK-5. In any case, the devs would need solid evidence.

[Asgar]

23 hours ago, Avimimus said:

If evidence could be found that the B6 used AP rounds for its Mk-103... then there is maybe a chance for that. I've doubts about the BK-5. In any case, the devs would need solid evidence.

I don’t think there is any doubt that the cannon could fire AP rounds. It’s the cannon of the Panzer III modified with a magazine and pneumatic autoloader. But it simply wasn’t used in the anti tank role. Hence no record of the BK-5 firing any AP rounds

[Avimimus]

Just now, Asgar said:

I don’t think there is any doubt that the cannon could fire AP rounds. It’s the cannon of the Panzer III modified with a magazine and pneumatic autoloader. But it simply wasn’t used in the anti tank role. Hence no record of the BK-5 firing any AP rounds

The same goes for the Mk-103 - it had AP rounds available (as in the Hs-129) - but there isn't evidence of the Me-410 using them... at least no evidence which has been provided to the devs.

[Asgar]

13 minutes ago, Avimimus said:

The same goes for the Mk-103 - it had AP rounds available (as in the Hs-129) - but there isn't evidence of the Me-410 using them... at least no evidence which has been provided to the devs.

Yes... and as my original comment reads: even if not historically used, tank busting with the BK-5 would be fun. 

I know we have people running around crying about authenticity, simple solution, servers can lock it and people can simply not use it in single player if they don't like it. I think technical capabitlity should be the deciding factor more often that real life usage. Cause IRL the 410 with BK-5 was desigened to hunt B-17 formations, which we don't have in game. We do however have many many tanks as target for tank busting. That's why i said it would be a nice to have.

Or if time permits the devs could add the Ju-88 P-4, it used the BK-5 as well and was used for tank busting on the eastern front

edit: btw. that is the round in question 😉

Edited 6 hours ago by Asgar